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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 62 post(s) |
Valterra Craven
204
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Posted - 2014.04.28 23:11:00 -
[1] - Quote
I'm going to keep asking this very simple question in every blog until it gets answered.
What the hell are you guys going to do with the Hyasyoda Mobile Laboratory to ensure that it stays roughly at the same price point it is now. AKA not making them useless and not making them OP. |
Valterra Craven
204
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Posted - 2014.04.28 23:14:00 -
[2] - Quote
Querns wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:I'm going to keep asking this very simple question in every blog until it gets answered.
What the hell are you guys going to do with the Hyasyoda Mobile Laboratory to ensure that it stays roughly at the same price point it is now. AKA not making them useless and not making them OP. I think everyone is waiting for the cost scaling blog before getting too concerned about pos module costs.
I'm not everyone, these are very very special modules. If these get nerfed its a huge penalty to the Caldari Epic line rewards, which may make them not worth running. |
Valterra Craven
204
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Posted - 2014.04.28 23:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:I'm going to keep asking this very simple question in every blog until it gets answered.
What the hell are you guys going to do with the Hyasyoda Mobile Laboratory to ensure that it stays roughly at the same price point it is now. AKA not making them useless and not making them OP. I'll check into this tomorrow.
While you are at it, could you guys ponder making corp slots in stations have the same infinite number as the sci and indy slots at the same cost scaling... :X Just throwing that out there... for ya know consistency sake...
Also, thanks for checking on this. |
Valterra Craven
204
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Posted - 2014.04.28 23:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
Dramaticus wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:Querns wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:I'm going to keep asking this very simple question in every blog until it gets answered.
What the hell are you guys going to do with the Hyasyoda Mobile Laboratory to ensure that it stays roughly at the same price point it is now. AKA not making them useless and not making them OP. I think everyone is waiting for the cost scaling blog before getting too concerned about pos module costs. I'm not everyone, these are very very special modules. If these get nerfed its a huge penalty to the Caldari Epic line rewards, which may make them not worth running. Sometimes you win the speculation game, sometimes you lose.
I'm not speculating on these, and judging from current prices no one is either. I've saved a few of them I was going to use for a personal pos, but it would be nice to know whether to dump them or keep them before this summer. |
Valterra Craven
208
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Posted - 2014.04.29 15:17:00 -
[5] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:
I don't think I agree that nobody will ever max out a battleship BPO after this. If the extra percent is actually relevant (which I assume it is, in T1 manufacturing), 60 days does not seem an unattainable number.
You don't agree? Has CCP done any ROI calculations on how much the 60 days of research on a high rank BPO are going to cost?
If you dont know what I mean, under the new research system, how long is it going to take someone to recoup the money it costs them to research that last level of ME when they are producing off of the BPO? So if it cost me a 100mil to research that last bit and my savings is 100k, I'm going to have to produce 100bs before I break even. If it took me a day to produce 1 bs the actual time it would take to realize the benefit from that last bit of ME would be 160 days... not 60.
^Also obviously I'm pulling numbers out of my butt here, but that was just to make an easy example. |
Valterra Craven
208
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Posted - 2014.04.29 15:19:00 -
[6] - Quote
And seriously though, have you guys done ANY calculations about how much you estimate prices for things will increase after the summer? It seems as though you guys are making things almost multiplicatively move expensive with each new dev blog you release. |
Valterra Craven
209
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Posted - 2014.04.29 16:56:00 -
[7] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote:
I don't think I agree that nobody will ever max out a battleship BPO after this. If the extra percent is actually relevant (which I assume it is, in T1 manufacturing), 60 days does not seem an unattainable number.
You don't agree? Has CCP done any ROI calculations on how much the 60 days of research on a high rank BPO are going to cost? If you dont know what I mean, under the new research system, how long is it going to take someone to recoup the money it costs them to research that last level of ME when they are producing off of the BPO? So if it cost me a 100mil to research that last bit and my savings is 100k, I'm going to have to produce 100bs before I break even. If it took me a day to produce 1 bs the actual time it would take to realize the benefit from that last bit of ME would be 160 days... not 60. ^Also obviously I'm pulling numbers out of my butt here, but that was just to make an easy example. The cost will be highly variable depending on where you choose to do it. For a BS you should be able to get it at a pretty reasonable price. 160 days does not seem like a long time period when you're talking about a billion-ISK blueprint. T2 BPOs change hands for decades' worth of profit; EVE industrialists, at the high-end, play a long game. On top of that, either the 1% is a big enough difference that it matters and people *will* research it, or it's a small enough difference that people won't bother researching it, at which point it doesn't matter.
If it doesn't matter than why have it in game at all?
The numbers I was using are pure fiction, I have no idea if that will be the cost of the total ROI. And honestly that was besides the point.
My question to CCP was, have YOU done any ROI calculations on what would be worth it and not worth it in terms of these changes? Do you have any idea(aka estimates) how much inflation/deflation will happen when all of these changes hit in summer?
If the answer to either of the above questions is no... then you shouldn't role these out till the answer is yes.
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Valterra Craven
209
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Posted - 2014.04.29 17:00:00 -
[8] - Quote
Also I find hilariously hypocritical that you guys aren't willing to touch POS code because the changes would be too massive and yet you are willing to undertake changes to industry that so far seem to have the potential to be much more massive and or game changing /game breaking than anything you could do with POS code. |
Valterra Craven
214
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Posted - 2014.05.01 05:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
I understand why CCP is doing what they are doing (even if I dont like it) in terms of the push vs pull mechanic in terms of industry, but one thing I don't understand is why the "optimal" ME levels are become so curvey instead of so linear? It seems alittle insane for a game thats only been going on 10 years to require someone to research a bpo for 6 years (even if a high end one) to reach level 10 ME. What exactly is the "gameplay" benefit or the reasoning behind doing this.... I just don't understand why you'd want to do this vs the old system where each level required the same amount of research time.
In any case, I have an idea for keeping numerous pos modules relevant.
Parallelism.
In other words the "killer feature" of POS would be to allow you to break up research jobs in parallel to complete them faster.
You have two mods, you can break them up to complete twice as fast and so and so forth.
I did some rough estimates, and it looks like with a dread gur tower and assuming labs cpu cost of 500 cpu would allow you to have 15 labs at once if that's all you put on it. So to balance this you could either hugely increase the cpu cost so that it wouldn't be wise to go over 3-4 labs, or limit the amount of jobs that you could run in parallel. (I'd say balance it on the average number of labs people run now). I'd also mess with the current numbers that labs give bonuses to so that they are closer to NPC stations. In this way, POS don't compete with NPC/Null stations in the same way.
To be fair this could also be adapted to production jobs as well. |
Valterra Craven
229
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Posted - 2014.05.16 20:24:00 -
[10] - Quote
Hashi Lebwohl wrote:
Example
A wolf BPO you can make 24 per week in high sec station. You cannot make more even if you want to.
How many wolves can you make using invention in a week?
Irrelevant. Invention has a floor build price. T2 BPOs can undercut that by a significant margin. This means you always have a market for your product and you always get the first sales. T2 BPOs should die. |
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Valterra Craven
229
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Posted - 2014.05.16 20:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Harvey James wrote:T2 BPO's need to die a painful death Restricting copying to POS labs would strongly promote that goal, no?
They should also be restricted to building only from POS as well.... |
Valterra Craven
229
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Posted - 2014.05.16 20:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
Apelacja wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:Malcanis wrote:Harvey James wrote:T2 BPO's need to die a painful death Restricting copying to POS labs would strongly promote that goal, no? They should also be restricted to building only from POS as well.... loled.. That would create new profession in eve T2 BPO hunting
Thats the point :) |
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